Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mandala

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analogdrummer
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Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mandala

Post by analogdrummer »

While working with my Mandala this weekend, I managed to route the radial MIDI control signal into Ableton Live. This lets me control effects (filter cutoff, delay, etc.) by moving around the head. I was surprised that no one had posted anything like this to YouTube, so I threw together a video describing the process.

http://youtu.be/vF6xgJbXSwQ

Not a great patch, but it should illustrate what is possible.
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Morgan Hendry

Permutations: (http://morganhendry.bandcamp.com)
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analogdrummer
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Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by analogdrummer »

I guess I'll respond to my own thread...

I am very interested if there is a way to use the 0-127 CC signal from the Mandala in Ableton Live without an intermediary piece of software (like Pure Data or Max for Live). If any of you have any thoughts, I'd be eager to hear them. I've had Live for several years now, and one of my biggest gripes is the inability to attach a CC signal from a specific MIDI channel to a control in the software for a non-recognized controller. It really hampers using old MIDI hardware and DIY controllers. But I could easily be missing something that's already in place within Ableton.

Even if Live is recognizing the Mandala, I don't see how you tell Live to listen to the CC signal as opposed to the note signal. Every time I click on a parameter (like filter cutoff) and hit the drum in MIDI map mode, it defaults to the note I'm playing. I mean, I guess this makes sense: the Mandala is a multi-dimensional controller. Is there a way to "turn off" unwanted signals (note number, velocity) while assigning controls in Ableton, but then turn them back on afterwards? Does that make sense? I think that's pretty much what I managed to do with the Pure Data patch.

Just want to know if I'm missing something here.
--------------------------------------
Morgan Hendry

Permutations: (http://morganhendry.bandcamp.com)
Beware of Safety: (http://www.bewareofsafety.com)
The Laterite Road: (http://www.thelateriteroad.com)
Blog: (http://morganhendry.wordpress.com/)
launch54321
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Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2011 8:24 pm

Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by launch54321 »

I've been trying to do that with Live too but no matter what external controller I use it always only links up with the last MIDI message that hits it. I guess that makes it easy for a lot of people, but in our case the lack of manual entry is a hindrance. I'll post up here if I make any progress...
saucehp
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Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:45 am

Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by saucehp »

The Ableton boys would need to do an update that allowed the user to pick which successive signal was picked i imagine.

The Pure data method works great for now. Thanks for sharing this.

I cant see Max 4 Live being a work around as it is further down the chain so to speak.

I was curious have either of you delved further into instrument rack and Drum Rack set ups?
In instrument rack you can restrict the midi in via the key display allowing you to build instruments related to each zone. you can do this with drum racks as well though it appears you have more control options with instrument racks e.g velocity control, chain effect fades etc. Saving the racks as presets for the mandala looks very promising.

Regards
D :geek:
analogdrummer
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Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by analogdrummer »

saucehp wrote: I was curious have either of you delved further into instrument rack and Drum Rack set ups?
In short, I have. When Live 9 came out, I plunked down the extra cash for the Suite with Max for Live. While I haven't had nearly enough time to get into what you can do with it, I did manage to find a way to get the Mandalas fully working in Ableton without using Pure Data. It's pretty straightforward:
Picture of the MIDI effect rack.
Picture of the MIDI effect rack.
max4live_drumeffectrack.png (75.12 KiB) Viewed 6799 times
1. MIDI effect rack (hold everything in one place)
2. Max Api CtrlMIDInote (for mapping pad velocity to any parameter)
3. Max Api CtrlMIDIcc (for mapping pad position (CC 110) to any parameter)
4. Note Length (for extending MIDI note so Ableton to shows that you're hitting the pad, can turn down or off after mapping)
5. Scale (for controlling what zones trigger what sounds)

After the effect rack, you can put a drum rack, synthesizer, etc. Of the many things on my to do list is video demo of the above (or at least a better writeup).

Longer term, I'd love to whip up something cleaner in Max for Live, one plug in that does the work of that set and lets you utilize the CC change available in each zone, etc. If there are any other (more experienced) Max for Live users out there, maybe we can make this a Mandala community project. For now though, the above seems like it is a workable solution.

Morgan
--------------------------------------
Morgan Hendry

Permutations: (http://morganhendry.bandcamp.com)
Beware of Safety: (http://www.bewareofsafety.com)
The Laterite Road: (http://www.thelateriteroad.com)
Blog: (http://morganhendry.wordpress.com/)
saucehp
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:45 am

Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by saucehp »

Looks awesome Morgan,

I wish i had the bucks and time to invest in Live 9.
I'll see if i can do the api in my version of live... Once i get my Mandala currently i'm just preparing things using a TD9.

I recently checked up on some max4live reassignment devices i made as well as some online community projects. I'm sure we can get a device happening. Once i get a free day i'll delve into it!!

Regards.
D
analogdrummer
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Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:41 pm
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Re: Modulating Synths and Effects in Ableton Live Using Mand

Post by analogdrummer »

Saucehp, I think I figured it out without max and pure data...

http://synesthesiacorp.com/forums/viewt ... 1163#p1475
--------------------------------------
Morgan Hendry

Permutations: (http://morganhendry.bandcamp.com)
Beware of Safety: (http://www.bewareofsafety.com)
The Laterite Road: (http://www.thelateriteroad.com)
Blog: (http://morganhendry.wordpress.com/)
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